Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (19 of 19), Read 10 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Beej Connor connorva@mindspring.com 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, October 10, 2001 10:14 PM 


I'm not far from the end of 'Blindness' now, and for
awhile I've tried to figure out what Saramago really
means by the word 'blindness'. I'm sure the entire novel
is allegorical.

Is this really the story of man's blindness to the terrible
things that happen in life, just as these people in the
book are blind to the terrible things happening in the
asylum?

In a way, 'Blindness' reminds me of a Stephen King
novel.

Beej

 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (20 of 32), Read 34 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     Mary Anne Papale mapreads@aol.com 
 Date: 
     Thursday, October 11, 2001 07:14 PM 


Beej, I agree with you that this must be allegorical, but I was
thinking more of society's blindness and indifference to the
needs of humanity.

MAP

 
 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (21 of 32), Read 33 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     Beej Connor connorva@mindspring.com 
 Date: 
     Thursday, October 11, 2001 10:10 PM 


MAP, yes, I think so, too. And I think this book is frightening in
its portrayal of how quickly people can become so completely
uncivilized once human dignity is dismissed. 

Beej

 
 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (22 of 32), Read 25 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     Anne Wilfong anne.wilfong@gte.net 
 Date: 
     Saturday, October 13, 2001 04:23 PM 


Oh my.

I just finished this book and am blown away by feelings I
cannot define. 

I keep wondering what sort of allegorical message I'm
supposed to come away with, and all I can come up with right
now is that there is no comparable message. Instead, there is
only human nature. More complex than we can ever
understand, for better or worse.

Best book I've read all year, without a doubt.

Anne

 
 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (23 of 32), Read 22 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     Ann Davey davey@tconl.com 
 Date: 
     Sunday, October 14, 2001 04:14 PM 


I just finished this one myself. This is a wonderful book, once
you get past the lack of paragraphs and conventional
punctuation. For those of you who write, can you please
explain to me why an author would choose to take that
approach?

As several have mentioned, you get (almost) used to the
run-on paragraphs fairly quickly. Much more important is what
this author has to say and the beautiful way in which he
expresses it. 

In many ways this is a very discouraging book. The story
shows how people all too soon degenerate into animal
behavior. But some of the characters rise above the squalor
and terror that surround them. The doctor's wife, for example,
is truly inspirational. Other characters show signs of true
humanity, such as the girl with the dark glasses who becomes
a mother figure to the boy who squints.

PLOT SPOILER *****************************

For me the most haunting image in a book full of them is the
church at the end of the book, where all the statues and the
pictures of Christ and the saints have their eyes covered. This
strikes me as a rebellion against God, who watches humanity
suffer, but does nothing. If we can't see, you shouldn't be able
to either, the person who covered the eyes seems to have
decided.

At the end of the book, the doctor and his wife have a
conversation. The doctor's wife, the heroine of the story, says
people didn't "go blind," they "are blind." "Blind, but seeing,"
her husband replies. "Blind people who can see, but do not see
(italics added)." (As with most of the conversation, it is difficult
to say who precisely is speaking which lines.)

Perhaps this is the message of the book, that we choose to
ignore so much of the misery that goes on around us so that
we can be safe in our own little words.

And is that really so bad? I'm not sure. After all the doctor's
wife nearly goes mad with the burden of seeing all that is really
happening.

Ann

 
 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (24 of 32), Read 21 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
     Sunday, October 14, 2001 04:34 PM 



The Parable of the Blind Leading the Blind1568
BRUEGEL, Pieter the Elder 
Tempera on canvas, 86 x 154 cm
Galleria Nazionale, Naples

Ruth

"Citizen!
Consider my traveling expenses: Poetry—all of it—is a trip into
the unknown. " Vladimir Mayakovksy

 
 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (25 of 32), Read 19 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     Anne Wilfong anne.wilfong@gte.net 
 Date: 
     Sunday, October 14, 2001 05:55 PM 


If these were Saramago's blind, I'd expect them to be in
tatters and covered with excrement...a still-chilling thought.

Anne

 
 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (26 of 32), Read 15 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
     Sunday, October 14, 2001 06:14 PM 


Ann, I've been thinking a bit on Saramago's choice to write this
way. Is it always this way? I read Baltazar and Blimunda, but
I've forgotten.

This style seemed to me to fit the subject of blindness very
well, one sentence following another, almost as if they were
afraid to let go, almost like the people in Breughel's painting. 

But if he always writes this way, that kind of knocks that
hypothesis into a cocked teapot.

Anne, if Breughel's blind are reasonably clean now, just watch.
Sooner or later they're going to fall into the cesspit.

Ruth

"Citizen!
Consider my traveling expenses: Poetry—all of it—is a trip into
the unknown. " Vladimir Mayakovksy

 
 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (27 of 32), Read 16 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     Ann Davey davey@tconl.com 
 Date: 
     Sunday, October 14, 2001 07:45 PM 


Ruth,
He wrote much the same way in Baltazar and Blimunda, except
that the latter has a lot more long descriptive passages and a
kind of omniscient first person narrator. He runs the dialog
together in both books. After awhile you figure out that a
capital letter usually indicates that a new person is speaking.
These conversations give his book a kind of breathless quality.
One character speaks a few lines, followed by another,
answered by the first, etc. There are few long speeches.

I loved the originality and daring of this book. Although we
never learn any of the characters names, we feel we know
them well by the end of the book. Much of the subject matter is
revolting -- filth, barbarity, raping, murder, etc. -- and yet the
writing was so good and the characters so touching that it was
difficult to put this book down. 

Ann

 
 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (28 of 32), Read 15 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
     Sunday, October 14, 2001 08:30 PM 


I agree, Ann. This was a terrific book, one I shall never forget.

And all the time I was reading it, I kept seeing Breughel's
Parable of the Blind.

Now about the doctor's wife..(Oh, I do think it's nice that the
doctor's wife seems to be the heroine. Generally, we get such
a bad rap.)...I think she' was left sighted so that we would
have someone's eyes to see the scene through, so we wouldn't
be left fumbling in the dark like everyone else. So she's a
literary device.

But she's much more than that, don't you think? I'm interested
in others' thoughts on this.

Ruth

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought,
but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." Albert
Einstein

 
 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (29 of 32), Read 14 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     Ann Davey davey@tconl.com 
 Date: 
     Sunday, October 14, 2001 10:54 PM 


Ruth,
Yes, I agree that one character had to retain her sight in order
to make the novel work, and I also agree that she was much
more than a literary device. Her attitude towards her husband
and the girl with the glasses was almost saintly. :) And yet, she
seemed very down to earth and real to me. She was a
character who became stronger and better through adversity,
even though at times the burden almost broke her. Very few of
us could behave as well as she did under the same
circumstances.

***PLOT SPOILER*** 
Do you think it was inevitable that Saramago made her go
blind just as the others were regaining their sight? There was a
lot of foreshadowing that eventually she would lose her sight
too, but as a reader I hated to see it happen. Did it tie up
things just a bit too neatly? 

What does everyone else think?

Ann

 
 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (30 of 32), Read 13 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     Anne Wilfong anne.wilfong@gte.net 
 Date: 
     Sunday, October 14, 2001 11:24 PM 


Ann,

I didn't interpret the ending that way.

Then she lifted he head up to the sky and saw everything
white, milky white, It's my turn, she thought. Fear made her
quickly lower her eyes. The city was still there.

I believe she still feared the blindness, but she could still see
the city.

Any other thoughts?

The scene that made such a huge impression on me was when
the women were on the balcony in the rain, and the girl with
the dark glasses and the wife of the first blind man were telling
her how beautiful the doctor's wife was. That was such a
powerful scene.

The writing pattern worked to catch me up in the intensity of
the story. I had to force myself to slow down in order to savor
the beauty of the writing. And I agree that the ploy of not using
names was to the reader's benefit. It helped us to associate
the characters with attributes that we might otherwise not
"see."

Anne
"Inside us there is something that has no name, that something
is what we are."--the girl with the dark glasses

 
 

 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (31 of 32), Read 15 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
     Monday, October 15, 2001 12:41 AM 


Yes, that rain scene on the balcony was almost lyrical wasn't it?
But I'm not sure about that business of our seeing the
attributes more clearly because the person isn't name. Terms
like "doctor's wife," or "woman with the dark glasses," don't
give us any more insight than "Pamela," or "Lucinda."

Ruth

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought,
but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." Albert
Einstein


 Topic: 
     BLINDNESS by José Saramago (32 of 32), Read 11 times 
         
 Conf: 
     Reading List 
 From: 
     Beej Connor connorva@mindspring.com 
 Date: 
     Monday, October 15, 2001 08:00 AM 


I didn't think she went blind either. For some reason, she was
immune to this but it was never explained why or how. I was a
bit disappointed that this was not revealed to us. 

I think one of the reasons the names were not told was to give
us a feeling of a universal affliction. As in most major crises,
we often don't know names, we are more involved in the crises
itself, rather than the individuals affected. Saramago gets us
somewhat involved in the individual's stories but as a whole, at
least to me, its the magnitude of the disease he most wants us
to center on.

I'm curious as to what others here think of the fact that the
blindness was 'white'. To me, white is the symbol of purity. and
I think, possibly, that has great meaning within the allegorical
context.


Beej

 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (33 of 46), Read 22
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
      Monday, October 15, 2001 12:22 PM 


I didn't mind that there was no explanation as to why the
doctor's wife didn't go blind. There was no explanation as to
why the others did go blind. If this had been science fiction,
the explanations would have been there, but in this book
we're focussed on other things.

As to why the blindness was white. At first I thought it was just
to make it differ from regular blindness. Then I did a little
brainstorming. In pigments, white is no color, black is all
colors mixed. It's just the opposite in visible light. White is all
colors of light mixed, black is no light. White is light, black is
dark. Can anyone else add to this list?

Ruth

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought,
but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." Albert
Einstein

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (34 of 46), Read 23
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Beej Connor connorva@mindspring.com 
 Date: 
      Monday, October 15, 2001 12:37 PM 


I saw the white as a symbol of purity.. sort of a purification
from having to experience the awfulness in life. 

Throughout this novel, the words to 'Amazing Grace' kept
running through my mind.
I have no idea why this song meshed with this book for me.

Beej

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (35 of 46), Read 22
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Ann Davey davey@tconl.com 
 Date: 
      Monday, October 15, 2001 02:03 PM 


Out of curiosity, am I the only one who thought the doctor's
wife became blind at the end? I agree that the last line "The
city was still there" could mean that she saw it when she
looked down, but then what was the significance of her seeing
everything white when she looked up to the sky? 
For me, black means absence; the whiteness meant that the
things were still actually there, but the light was so blinding
that the people could not discern them.

Ann

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (36 of 46), Read 21
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
      Monday, October 15, 2001 02:08 PM 


I was sitting firmly on the fence about the doctor's wife at the
end. Was she blind or wasn't she? I couldn't tell. Perhaps this
was a central question that Saramago meant to leave
unanswered. Why would you think that would be?

Ruth

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought,
but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." Albert
Einstein

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (37 of 46), Read 21
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Jane Niemeier jniemeie@hotmail.com 
 Date: 
      Monday, October 15, 2001 09:22 PM 


Ann,
I thought that the doctor's wife could see at the end as well. I
think that the sky was white as it is sometimes, so she was
worried that it was her turn, as she said. But the last line tells
me that she could still see the city,

I keep thinking about the church scene where all of the saints
had on blindfolds or there was white paint across the eyes in
the paintings. The doctor's wife said that only one statue of a
woman didn't have a blindfold. This was the woman whose
eyes had been gouged out, and she was carrying her eyes. I
felt that this woman represented the doctor's wife. She didn't
experience the white blindness, but she was suffering because
she was the eyes of everyone else. It was as if she were
carrying her eyes before her. I also felt that at one point, the
doctor's wife was thinking about gouging her own eyes out
when she found the scissors. Did anyone else get that feeling?

I found it interesting that the doctor felt that life would return
to normal quickly. He was hoping to remove the cataract from
the eye of the man with the patch. To me, it seemed unlikely
that the return to normalcy would happen soon. I kept
thinking about the collapse of the financial institutions and the
lack of services.
Jane

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (38 of 46), Read 22
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Beej Connor connorva@mindspring.com 
 Date: 
      Monday, October 15, 2001 09:50 PM 


Jane, good note. That church scene was incredibly powerful. 

She not only suffered because she was the eyes for them all,
but she also knew this would happen. she went into this,
well... with her eyes wide open, so to speak. But, what choice
did she have but to let them know she was not blind?

who do you suppose suffered more, the ones who could not
see or the one who could see?

I was soo worried they would end up eating the dog of tears.

Jane, you said earlier that, as you read this, your eyes began
to bother you. As I read this, I had the recurring urge to wash
my feet. I have a REAL 'thing' about clean feet and all that
excrement they continuously walked through got to me.

Beej

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (39 of 46), Read 20
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
      Monday, October 15, 2001 10:06 PM 


I,too, was afraid they were going eat that poor dog. I love
that "name," it's more resonant than the "names" of all the
people. "The Dog of Tears," wow.

Ruth

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought,
but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." Albert
Einstein

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (40 of 46), Read 19
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Beej Connor connorva@mindspring.com 
 Date: 
      Monday, October 15, 2001 10:16 PM 


The "names' by which they referred to one another intrigued
me. 
When you think of it, all surnames evolved within new
societies from either professions or personal descriptions. And
so, as a new 'society' the same seemed to be happening here.

Beej

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (41 of 46), Read 21
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Beej Connor connorva@mindspring.com 
 Date: 
      Monday, October 15, 2001 10:22 PM 


By the way, Ruth, that Bruegel painting you posted is very
emotionally stirring and appropriate for this story. Its exactly
as I pictured these poor people as they were herded into the
'pseudo-concentration camp'.


Beej

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (42 of 46), Read 17
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Anne Wilfong anne.wilfong@gte.net 
 Date: 
      Monday, October 15, 2001 11:04 PM 


Jane,

I liked your comparison of the doctor's wife to Lucy, patron
saint of the blind. (My sister has a little Lucy statue on her
dresser, and I admit it cracked me up to see the eyes on the
plate in front of her!But now I have extreme respect!)

Given the choice, I imagine I'd prefer to be sighted in a blind
world than blind with all the others.The horrors would be
different, no less, no worse, but I'd feel less vulnerable.
Maybe.

Anne

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (43 of 46), Read 18
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Ann Davey davey@tconl.com 
 Date: 
      Monday, October 15, 2001 11:57 PM 


Jane,
Excellent observation about the saint carrying her eyes.

Anne, I too would choose to be sighted, even though I believe
that the doctor's wife experienced more horror than the other
characters.

This was a fable. In real life, I wonder if the people who had
been born blind or been blind for many years would take over
and get things organized. These people would certainly know
how to compensate for their lack of sight better. What do you
think?


Ann

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (44 of 46), Read 14
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Jane Niemeier jniemeie@hotmail.com 
 Date: 
      Tuesday, October 16, 2001 09:41 PM 


I am enjoying everyone's notes. I ,too, would prefer to keep
my eyesight, and Beej, I know how you feel about the clean
feet. I kept hoping that they would all get a chance to bathe,
because I think that is one of the great luxuries of the modern
world: to bathe every single day. I recently heard from my
mother-in-law who was talking to a woman missionary who
recently returned from Afghanistan. According to this woman,
the Taliban has told women that they can't bathe at all!

During the church scene, I kept wondering if the doctor's wife
pulled all the blindfolds off the statues, would the people
regain their sight? That was before I knew the ending.

This book shows how much misery the human spirit can
endure. I guess that the concentration camp survivors really
are a testament to this spirit. It makes me wonder how much
I could survive, given my pampered upbringing. By
pampered, I mean that I was raised in comfort, not
necessarily in luxury.

Jane

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (45 of 46), Read 15
      times  
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, October 17, 2001 12:08 AM 


And, like Lord of the Flies it shows us how thin a veneer is
civilization.

Ruth

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought,
but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." Albert
Einstein


 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (46 of 46), Read 5 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Sherry Keller shkell@starband.net 
 Date: 
      Thursday, October 18, 2001 07:07 AM 


I've enjoyed everyone's notes. What a powerful book; one
that invaded my dreams last night. Anne, you picked the
scene I liked best, too, the balcony scene. I thought the
water-drinking scene was powerful, too. Like a church ritual, a
blessing.

What did people think about the hellish basement? Why was
there a light down there? And why did this finally overcome
the doctor's wife. It seems to me she had seen worse.


Sherry


 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (47 of 47), Read 0 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Tonya Presley t-pr@home.com 
 Date: 
      Thursday, October 18, 2001 11:30 AM 


I've only read a few of the notes here, and I've only started
re-reading the book. It is, without a doubt the best book I
read the year it was published, and still one of the best and
most memorable books I've ever read. And since some of the
impressions and ideas I got during that first reading remain,
I'll venture to comment on a couple of things that have come
up here.

I remember thinking, when I first noticed that none of the
characters would be named, that this was just fantastic.
Except for Russian novels, names can be the worst part of
reading a foreign book to me. I tend to scan past names that
are unfamiliar or difficult to me, so that in the end I can easily
lose track of individuals within novels. I had no trouble of that
sort in Blindness. By the end, though, I thought Saramago's
decision to eliminate names made the book completely
universal; if the book had been about Jane and Dick, you'd
read it picturing America, and adding elements from your
experience and imagination. If it were about Maria and Juan
you'd have another picture and another set of notions. Ditto
Irina and Vladimir, and so on and so on. 

I was totally blown away by the notion of "white" blindness.
During both the first reading and this one, I find myself trying
to "see" that, when I'm reading or at night, when I put the
book down and turn out the lights. I'm obsessed by the
concept.

Jane, I remember having exactly the same thought, that
removing the blindfolds would restore the others' sight.

For the record, the second reading is better than the first,
even! I wouldn't have thought it possible.

Tonya

 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (48 of 56), Read 26 times
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Tonya Presley t-pr@home.com 
 Date: 
      Thursday, October 18, 2001 02:03 PM 


Found this on the web:

From THE INDEPENDENT October 9th 1998:

His best work, Blindness, is a disturbing allegory about
social meltdown. "This blindness isn't a real blindness -
it's a blindness of rationality," he said recently. "We're
rational beings, but we don't behave rationally. If we did,
there'd be no starvation in the world."

I enjoyed the entire article:

http://www.portembassy.gla.ac.uk/info/saramago.html

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (49 of 56), Read 24 times
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Ann Davey davey@tconl.com 
 Date: 
      Thursday, October 18, 2001 03:43 PM 


Tonya,
Thanks for nominating this book and for the link to that
article. Good point about the relationship between the
lack of proper names and the universality of the
characters. It certainly makes sense now that you have
mentioned it.

Sherry, the doctor's wife was counting on that food
supply in the basement. Without it, it appeared that they
would all starve to death. I think the realization that it
was gone, coupled with the horrible evidence of how
these people had died, made her become unhinged.

Ann

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (50 of 56), Read 20 times
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Sherry Keller shkell@starband.net 
 Date: 
      Thursday, October 18, 2001 05:19 PM 


Ann, to me there seemed to be more to it. There was
this eery light coming from the basement. What was
that? It seemed like a metaphor for hell -- the
culmination of all the evil that was done, whether on
purpose or by accident. What she did was not evil, but it
resulted in a terrible tragedy. Who would have thought
that eating a sausage could cause such trouble?


Sherry

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (51 of 56), Read 21 times
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      S.F. Strahan 
 Date: 
      Thursday, October 18, 2001 06:55 PM 


I read this book back in the spring (because I just
couldn't wait). It has stayed with me in rather vivid detail
though.

I, too, thought the doctor's wife went blind at the end.

One thing I thought of as I read the book was an old
science fiction novel (good book, made into a really
hokey movie) The Day Of The Triffids by John Wyndham.
That book, too, as I recall, had some very realistic scenes
of the panicky people and the way society fell apart
quickly when everyone went blind. Moving from place to
place, scavenging, etc. Of course that book, written
some decades ago, was no where near as brutal and
graphic as Blindness and it had alien predators (triffids)
rather than human predators.

Still, Blindness made me think of it again after all these
years...there can't be all that many books written about
the whole world mysteriously going blind at the same
time.

I think books like these show that civilization as we
know it is more vulnerable to disruption than we think it
is and that human beings are resourceful and resilient in
the wake of disaster. 

At least that is what I'd *like* to take away from
Blindness. The violence and brutality are what have
lingered distastefully in my mind over the months since I
read it. It's a grim little book.

~~Susan~~

"Then would you read a Sustaining Book, such as would
help and comfort a Wedged Bear in Great Tightness?"
---Winnie The Pooh

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (52 of 56), Read 13 times
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Dale Short dshort@bham.rr.com 
 Date: 
      Friday, October 19, 2001 06:58 PM 


What a relentlessly immediate, disturbing, horrible,
beautiful book this is. I'll have to let it sink in for a while
before I can say more, but I'm enjoying everyone's
notes.

>>Dale in Ala.

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (53 of 56), Read 14 times
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
      Friday, October 19, 2001 07:06 PM 


I'm as bowled over as you are, Dale. There's just so
much to think about. And I'm sure there're all sorts of
symbols and metaphors we're missing.

Ruth

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be
fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and
stones." Albert Einstein

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (54 of 56), Read 9 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Jane Niemeier jniemeie@hotmail.com 
 Date: 
      Friday, October 19, 2001 09:59 PM 


Sherry,
I haven't gone back to check, but I thought that the light
under the door was supposed to be caused by the
rotting bodies that had fallen down the stairs. These
bodies created a kind of gas like swamp gas that was
burning. It was a hellish scene.
Jane

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (55 of 56), Read 7 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
      Friday, October 19, 2001 10:01 PM 


That was the scene as I understood it, too, Jane. 

Interesting that it was DOWN, and it was (as you say)
HELLISH.

Ruth

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be
fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and
stones." Albert Einstein


 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (56 of 56), Read 5 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Sherry Keller shkell@starband.net 
 Date: 
      Saturday, October 20, 2001 07:17 AM 


I didn't know bodies would do that, but I didn't think
Saramego would have anything supernatural
representing hell. He didn't need to. Well, the blindness
was sort of supernatural. 

Sherry

 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (57 of 64), Read 16 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Dale Short dshort@bham.rr.com 
 Date: 
      Tuesday, October 23, 2001 07:20 PM 


As if BLINDNESS weren't enough of an emotional
juggernaut on its own, reading it against the backdrop of
this week's current bio-events has been downright eerie.

I don't know where to start in saying how much I admire
Saramago's achievement here. The fact that he maintains
occasional flashes of dark humor and never goes maudlin
or preachy during such a horrible odyssey is part of it.

Another miracle to me is the simplicity and beauty with
which the author renders their return to "normal" life after
their escape from the camp. Ordinary pleasures like
drinking clean water or standing naked in the rain take on
an exalted, almost holy, quality. This book's going to stay
in my mind for a long, long time, I think.

>>Dale in Ala. 

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (58 of 64), Read 14 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Sherry Keller shkell@starband.net 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, October 24, 2001 06:48 AM 


Did anyone else besides me have a need to try to imagine
what life would be like once everyone had re-gained their
sight? I wondered what government would emerge, how
the economy would start over, how life would change
after the cataclysm. Would it eventually settle down and
be like before? How would people react to the
government after their treatment in the quarantine
facilities? Would any lessons be learned? 

Sherry

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (59 of 64), Read 17 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Beej Connor connorva@mindspring.com 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, October 24, 2001 08:02 AM 


Sherry, I wondered about that, too. I'll bet it would be a
long, long time before any sense of security returned. Not
only would it probably be difficult for them not to worry
that it could happen again, but also that their government
would take care of them.

Beej

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (60 of 64), Read 15 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Dale Short dshort@bham.rr.com 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, October 24, 2001 11:28 AM 


As to what comes now for these folks...my first inclination
is that, having seen so much chaos and horror up close,
they'll become fervent members of what the conservative
news commentators are currently referring to, so
sneeringly, as "the civil liberties crowd."

On the other hand, my guess is that whatever was on
that country's law books at the time of the disaster was
pretty much irrelevant in practice. Once the excrement hits
the fan to that extent, the worst of each individual's
human nature easily trumps what's written on a page--or
woven into a flag, for that matter, but don't get me
started.

So do these people become fatalists, going through the
motions of life and just hoping to God nothing that terrible
happens again?

And, about those blindfolded religious icons...{G}

>>Dale in Ala. 

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (61 of 64), Read 14 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Dale Short dshort@bham.rr.com 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, October 24, 2001 11:52 AM 


PS...I hear that federal emergency planners are
brainstorming with producers of Hollywood disaster
movies about the WORST that can go wrong in a
large-scale disaster. My guess is they'd be better off
putting Saramago on retainer, instead.

>>Dale in Ala.

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (62 of 64), Read 13 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Candy Minx candyminx@hotmail.com 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, October 24, 2001 11:56 AM 


I finally had a chance to re-read this book last week. I
have really enjoyed catching up on everyones posts here,
fabulous! I repeat what Tonya said, that this is even
better the second time around. This stand s out as one of
the greatest science fiction novels of all. gail, you asked if
this reminded us of another story...well I read a book here
a few mmonths ago---that reminded me of Blindness, it
was called Waiting For The Barbarians. Another brilliant
science fiction novel. Allso, another ood connection was
Ruth's with Lord Of The Flies.

I don't have much to add to all the amazing thoughts
already here...um Dale, your last posts have really got me
choked up along with thinking about this novel.

And Tonya, thanks for that link and quote---of course I
liked it because of the part about how much we are not
rational or we won't having starving people---see, things
often often get metered by how we treat food!

many things to think about love all the thoughts here, and
feeling sad too
Candy

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (63 of 64), Read 7 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Sherry Keller shkell@starband.net 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, October 24, 2001 12:18 PM 


Candy, I thought of Waiting for the Barbarians too. I forgot
to mention it. That was another novel where there were
no names. Coetzee "named" his characters in much the
same way that Saramego did. Both of these books make
me think that man does not need Satan, he contrives his
own hell. But he can also create his own hope. 

Another thought. We were wondering whether the
doctor's wife went blind in the end, and it still seems
unsure to me. I had a feeling that she almost wanted to
go blind. She needed the rest; was tired of being the eyes
for everyone. Blindness wouldn't be as frightening if you
knew it would pass.

Sherry


 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (64 of 64), Read 6 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, October 24, 2001 02:45 PM 


I wondered about the future, too. But with an attitude
much less optimistic than yours, Dale. I'm afraid that
having seen so much chaos and horror up close, they'll
become fervent members of the conservative
grab-what-you-want-and-hang-onto-it-no-matter-the-cost-to-others
crowd.

In other words, chaos. Not unlike the period of blindness,
with the toughest dog making it to the top of the pile, and
others willing to follow, willing to give up liberty, just so
that the trains will run on time.

Ruth

"I don't have a favorite song. I only have the song I'm
singing today" Berenice Reagon

 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (70 of 77), Read 33 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Dale Short dshort@bham.rr.com 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, November 07, 2001 12:33 PM 


William: Glad to have you on Constant Reader. Enjoyed
your comments. BLINDNESS is still haunting me, and I
have a few questions I'd like to pose to you guys as soon
as I can get my mind around them.

gail: My library copy (hardcover) of BLINDNESS is 293
pages. I found it to be very fast, and compelling, reading,
which kept me up late a couple of nights and then edged
into my dreams. I think most any book group could really
get its teeth into this.

>>Dale in Ala.

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (71 of 77), Read 18 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      William Hayes whayes43@hotmail.com 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, November 07, 2001 11:22 PM 


Saramago, old man and old writer both, has important
things to say about words and feelings.

p. 281ff "You were never more beautiful, said the wife of
the first blind man. Words are like that, they deceive, they
pile up, it seems they do not know where to go, and
suddenly, because of two or three or four that suddenly
come out, simple in themselves ... we have the
excitement of seeing them come irresistibly to the surface
through the skin and the eyes and upsetting the
composure of our feelings..., it was as if they were
wearing armour, we might say. The doctor's wife has
nerves of steel, and yet the doctor's wife is reduced to
tears because of a personal pronoun, an adverb, a verb,
an adjective, mere grammatical categories, mere labels,
just like the two women, the others, indefinite pronouns,
they too are crying, they embrace the woman of the
whole sentence, three graces beneath the falling rain."

This passage stopped my reading still. I have tried to
imagine this scene filmed -- who to cast as the "three
graces" embodying and bestowing beauty and charm --
and have realized both the richness and the poverty of
filmic diction: we would hear those five words spoken, we
would see the feelings exhibited in response, but we
would understand nothing, receive not an iota of insight
about the powerful linkage that Saramago posits
between those words and those feelings -- or is that just
my view?!

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (72 of 77), Read 17 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
      Wednesday, November 07, 2001 11:31 PM 


I agree absolutely, William. And it's why I'm more of a
reader than a movie-goer. With a book I've got both the
author's words, and the movie that I see in my head.
With a movie I've only got the movie someone else saw in
their head.

Before I get clobbered by the film lovers here, I will say
that there are some wonderful films. But it's different way
of doing things.

That's a great passage, William, thanks for posting it. I
think Blindness is going to top the list of best books of the
year for me.

Ruth

"I don't have a favorite song. I only have the song I'm
singing today" Berenice Reagon

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (73 of 77), Read 17 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Sherry Keller shkell@starband.net 
 Date: 
      Thursday, November 08, 2001 07:23 AM 


William, that was my absolute favorite part of the book.
Thanks for posting it. This is a book that bears rereading.

Sherry

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (74 of 77), Read 15 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      William Hayes whayes43@hotmail.com 
 Date: 
      Thursday, November 08, 2001 08:06 PM 


It is a wonderful book, isn't it. Please let me make
another nomination for a scene worth revisiting, namely.
the visit of the first blind man, his wife, and the doctor's
wife to the apartment where the first two used to live. It
begins on p 290 as follows:

"I am alone, my family went to look for food, perhaps I
should have said the women, but I do not think it would
be proper, he paused and then added, Yet you may think
that I should know,... I am a writer, we are supposed to
know such things."

And with these words Saramago begins what is for me a
most engaging statement, by a writer, about the struggle
to be a writer -- at least in our world. The blind writer
says in passing, "a writer manages to acquire in life the
patience he needs to write." Patience, indeed, and I
thought immediately of the the last line in Milton's sonnet
On His Blindness: "They also serve who only stand and
wait."

The doctor's wife makes two stunning contributions to the
scene. First, she raises again the subject of words and
feelings, which was the subject of the scene with the
three graces. "You are a writer, you have, as you said a
moment ago, an obligation to know words, therefore you
know that adjectives are of no use to us, if a person kills
another, for example, it would be better to state this fact
openly, directly, and to trust that the horror of the act,in
itself, is so shocking that there is no need for us to say it
was horrible, Do you mean that we have more words
than we need, I mean that we have too few feelings. Or
that we have them but have ceased to use the words
they express, And so we lose them."

Second, she discovers -- reveals, points to, I'm not sure
just how to put it -- the connection between the struggle
to live and the struggle to write: "she picked up the
written pages, there must have been about twenty, she
passed her eye over the tiny handwriting, over the lines
which went up and down, over the words inscribed on the
whiteness of the page, recorded in blindness, I am only
passing through, the writer has said, and these were the
signs he had left in passing." The whiteness of the page
lying blank before them, filling their eyes with the white
blindness, is surely what plagues all who write. And this
book, which is many fine things, is surely a metaphor for
the lifelong struggle of those among us who acquire the
patience in life to endure that plague, to endure that
white blindness.

I never would have read this book, except for a chance
visit to this web site. Thank you all -- it was a gift.

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (75 of 77), Read 15 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      R Bavetta rbavetta@prodigy.net 
 Date: 
      Thursday, November 08, 2001 08:21 PM 


adjectives are of no use to us....trust that the horror of the
act,in itself, is so shocking that there is no need for us to
say it was horrible

Thanks for pointing out these wonderful little comments
on writing, William.

And now that you've found us, stick around.

Ruth

"I don't have a favorite song. I only have the song I'm
singing today" Berenice Reagon 

 
 

 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (76 of 77), Read 17 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Ann Davey davey@tconl.com 
 Date: 
      Thursday, November 08, 2001 08:40 PM 


William,

I found that scene very poignant. What a tragedy to be a
writer, but have no one able to read your words. And yet,
that man kept on writing---

Ann


 Topic: 
      BLINDNESS by José Saramago (77 of 77), Read 13 times 
         
 Conf: 
      Reading List 
 From: 
      Anne Wilfong anne.wilfong@gte.net 
 Date: 
      Thursday, November 08, 2001 10:33 PM 


I think that's the point, Ann. Writers write because they
are driven to do so, not because there are eyes to read
the written word.

Anne